Rule of three's.........revised

[eagle326]

Maybe hope would have been better than faith?

In reality ; What's the difference between hope or faith? ( Survival )

One must have faith in them self that they have the skills to survive in order for the other items to take seed.
One can hope that they're skilled enough to survive but it cannot rule the natural instincts. It must be a back seat rider on the journey.

Hope is intended for future events. Where as surviving is in the present. The two can merge and will if one lives through the struggle. Then hope comes into play planning the future after the struggle.

As for faith.
Faith is the belief in yourself and your abilities to see you through your time of turmoil. No more or no less in my world.

Just my 2-cents

[Sniper-T]

still irrelevant... imo. HOPE is like faith... Nice, but unnecessary. people have the intrinsic need to survive built in... Like faith... hope may drive some forward, but is it a NEED or a RULE. no.

Look in the face of a true homeless person begging on the street... All they want is food/drink. They may sketch up a sign to play on your heartstrings, but all they want is food/drink! Gobbless!

[robsdak]

i will bite.

i am going have to stick with S-T, Eagle and SF on this one. basic needs are required, others, 'ehh, not so much'. for me anyways, other maybe different.

[jamesneuen]

but if survival isn't a choice then how would suicide be explained? (not trying to start an argument over that statement) If survival, faith, hope is not a conscious decision then how can a person decide to go against it. Our body has the majority of our actions made into a habit.

We get thirsty, we go get a drink. That is our mind responding to what our body tells it. Just like building a fire, or shelter when cold etc. But let's put a person like me in the middle of the desert with no water. I've never been in the desert. I don't know where I am going to find water. So I have two conscious choices. Go and try to find water or lay here and die because I don't know how. So how would you define that initial urge to go find it against all odds? It would be easier to give up and die rather than push myself through all the pain and disappointment if I don't think I can find it. Will to survive, stubborness, or just plain refusal to do nothing?

I would say that hope or faith belongs there more than air. My body naturally breathes. If I make the conscious effort to hold my breathe and pass out, I will start breathing again.

[robsdak]

sui·cide noun \ˈsü-ə-ˌsīd\

: the act of killing yourself because you do not want to continue living

: a person who commits suicide

: an action that ruins or destroys your career, social position, etc.

survival is a choice........... you can choose to or not. how is survival not a choice? suicide is a choice as well. it is the conscious decision too give up.

as for being the desert and not having the ability to locate water? sounds like bad planning/lack of training/lack of knowledge.

[Sniper-T]

Survival IS a choice... if you are thirsty, YOU tell your body to go get a drink. just as YOU can tell your body not to. It is not hard-coded into your being, it is just common sense. you can choose to ignore it, akin to ignoring anything else. It isn't faith that makes you stumble blindly accross a dessert, faith would result in an Artesian well popping up at your feet; along with the swedish bikini team... stubborness, is what pushes you to walk and walk and walk. YOU're conscious decision to say "I am not going to fucking die here"... Just as YOU can say 'fuck it' and lay down and wait until help arrives, albeit probably in the form of buzzards.

Make a conscious effort to stop breathing??? tie yourself to a rock and throw it off a bridge. It isn't your instincts, or your faith that unties the rope so you can live. it is your conscious mind... your will to live. and that has nothing to do with faith. As you descended, you mumbled 'oh god, oh fuck' oh god, oh fuck' all the way to the bottom, and once you hit bottom and you accepted that you were fucked, it wasn't God who untied the rope.

Suicide is a cowards way out. It is for the weak minded. Technically, God will accept and forgive anyone who asks for forgiveness, but in his mind he is shaking his head in disdain. Your body will start breathing again if you hold your breath and pass out... because it was designed to do so... not because you have faith, The same autonomic response will occur to the most blasphemous heathen!

[ElevenBravo]

Not for argument, but...

Survival IS a choice... if you are thirsty, YOU tell your body to go get a drink.

After being without water for two days, *I* did not tell my body I was thirsty... It was the other way around. After beating the bush with all my field gear, an M60 AND extra ammo for the damn thing, in 90 deg heat and humidity, I fail to see the validity of your point. I suspect the statement was well intentioned, but with limited personal experience.

Suicide is a cowards way out. It is for the weak minded.

Sounds like a pulpit answer, I doubt everyone that let them self go were cowards. I have not undergone cancer treatment, nor have I been diagnosed with limited time to live... but Ive been around those that were. The misery they endure, the pain that wont stop and the grim reaper getting closer, if they did take the express way out, Id think they were rather brave, than coward... I could never do it, I dont have the guts.

Technically, God will accept and forgive anyone who asks for forgiveness, but in his mind he is shaking his head in disdain.

Technically, thats a pulpit answer too... Not everyone is christian and subscribe to there beliefs, so I assume you are addressing those that do...

I am only pointing out the other side of the coin. Like it or not, the only way to think is not the way I think... or anyone else. That is all.

EB

[Sniper-T]

No offence taken EB... You make an interesting argument... will think on this for a bit and come back. remember like the op said:

Just wanted to see hear your opinions on it and I'm not saying faith has to mean religion or that companionship means people.

means we are all entitled to our opinions and encouraged to share them!

[ElevenBravo]

Thank you T for the respectful nod, I had hoped the post would be received as more expanding thought than something intending to create strife.

EB

[Sniper-T]

Aw shucks EB... you should know me by now... I try to generate conversation, while not alienating people. I like discussion. I like different opinions. I like to learn, to expand my horizons...

yeah, I guess I Am Canadian!

lol