Propane camper furnace issues...

[Sniper-T]

So I bought that camper last year, and plopped it down in the back 160 of my buddy's land. I go out for hunting season, and the damn furnace wont do shit!

Luckily, it only went down to -18C for a few days, the rest were around -5C so it was comfortable enough for sleeping, but it caused the windows to fog/ice up in a nasty fashion.

does anyone have experience with these things. I spent days making sure that the camper was level, the stove worked fine, but the furnace... not so much. Following instructions on the door, I turned it onto 'PILOT" lit it, held the button in for a couple minutes, and released, it 'seemed' like the burner lit, but no heat.

Thoughts?

Oh as an aside, when I closed it up, it had two 20# propane bottles in it, both half full in the beginning, but emptied via the stove. I added one new one for the last couple days, but no change on the furnace.

When I left, I pulled the new bottle, and took the second original bottle out, to find it was only finger tight on the hose. without the second bottle hooked up, a single bottle just vents through the open line....

Now, the camper is old, hadn't been touched in years when I bought it, and had a nice pile of dead moths/dust (no mice)

The grate to light the thing flips open, and like I said, everything works fine, except the heat. To take the rest of the grate off, will take some doing, (bending fins, etc)

does anyone know anything aout these things. cleaning, adjusting. ???
I'm thinking maybe the contacts, or an issue with the chimney. When I go back out on the weekend, I'll take what I need to pull the front off, but then what?

thoughts?

[bacpacker]

My parents used to have a camper and several times they had insects or ants build in the heater. Clean it out and worked fine again. Other than that, no clue.

[Sniper-T]

yeah, that still means ripping it out fro the wall. it is essentially built in.

I may try taking an air cylender and try blowing it out first, but am not sure how they work and don't want to blow something apat.

In a perfect world... I woulda gone up there a month before season... but... oops.

And no... it really isn't feasible to call in a repair guy.

[helomech]

yeah, that still means ripping it out fro the wall. it is essentially built in.

I may try taking an air cylender and try blowing it out first, but am not sure how they work and don't want to blow something apat.

In a perfect world... I woulda gone up there a month before season... but... oops.

And no... it really isn't feasible to call in a repair guy.


Find a guy that knows how to fix them and invite him on a hunt. Tell him he may want to bring some tools.

[Possom]

What I did on my deer camp camper is disconnect the original furnace and put in a single burner propane heater that mounts on the wall. I know this isn't the fix you were wanting to hear but it is by far the easiest.

I just crack a window to let a little air in while the heater is on. Never had a problem with carbon monoxide build up. I will not let the heater burn while I am sleeping but heat the trailer up before I go to bed. It will hold the heat fairly well and heats up quick again the next morning.

This is close to the unit I have in my camper. Works great.

http://www.ruralking.com/mr-heater-propane-blue-flame-heater-20-000-btu-mhvfb20tblp.html?utm_medium=google&utm_source=cse&CAWELAID=1624234044&catargetid=1708823525&cadevice=m&cagpspn=pla&gclid=COmVqY7i77oCFeHm7AodmBUA5Q

[Sniper-T]

Possum, that would probably work for next year, If I can't figure this one out by then. Helo.. too little time... I leave again in 4 days. but maybe I can look into that before late season... but by then we're playing with -30C. be nice to get it working before then. I know I'll be warm enough... but after snowmobiling for 6+ hours, I know the wife will want toastier! lol

A propane furnace is a simple thing... I HAVE to be missing something simple!

[helomech]

Well it probably has a thermocouple that will not let the gas heater part turn on until it gets hot enough from the pilot light. That is usually what goes wrong on them, easy to change. That is to stop the heater from turning on when the pilot light is not lit.

[Daca102090]

One issue for the older (1970s and 1980s) RV heater and stoves are the thermocouples that register there is a pilot light before opening the main burner valve.
I had both the oven and furnace ones get internally corroded, I think due to condensation over the seasons of non-use.
I took a propane torch to the thermocouple and heated each one until it was red hot then let it cool off before trying to light the appliance.
The one in the oven gave off a green flame before the torch got it completely heated up and I think that was some of the corrosion burning off and allowing it to work properly.
Both work properly three years after the fix.
Easy enough to try.

[Sniper-T]

except that the furnace thermo is screwed tightly against the panelling under the furnace. from the wrong side. I can cut the straps and try that, and then overscrew/washer to re-attach, but the theromo, looks sweet clean, and the stove/oven and fridge all work.

[Daca102090]

This isn't the thermostat, it would be the little copper rod looking thing that the pilot light touches when it is lit. This senses that there is a pilot light capable of lighting the burner and intended to keep raw gas from flooding the space.

To get to it with a torch would be through the little half dollar size grate/plate that you lift to light the pilot.

That is assuming that the furnace is older than the 1990's.
I think in the late 80's manufacturers went to sealed units that almost have to be disassembled to get to the internals and light using a push button piezo electric sparkers.

[Sniper-T]

that sounds about right Daca, I'll through a torch into my truck too.

I took a couple pics, but can't find my adapter card for an uplink.

[ElevenBravo]

Will the pilot light?
If it lights, but wont stay lit?

Im thinking thermocoupler myself too...

GL,
EB

[TroubleShooter]

I know this may sound stupid..but you said you turned to pilot and depressed button to light pilot.......After pilot is lit, dont you have to turn the button to on position... I now there are several different ones, I had one years ago which had off, pilot and on settings....But yes thermocoupler is common problem it kills gas even if you manually fire heater, getting gas to pilot usually indicates supply system is good.

[Sniper-T]

the pilot lights easily, and stays lit. the scoop above it seems to deflectthe flame in a clean and orderly manner, but I couldn't see much up that silly little hole to see what is what.

[TroubleShooter]

Make sure you dont have an "on" position for the gas valve. Then check your thermostat batteries or make sure your thermostat is working in camper

[ElevenBravo]

Wish you were closer, Id lend a hand.

EB

[Sniper-T]

yep sorry I should have said that. it is a 3 position dial
OFF
Pilot (with a note) will not heat from this positon)
On

for the pilot, you have to depress and hold until it lights, and then I assumed it was like the old seville fridge we had at the cabin, continue to hold until it 'clicks' and lights.

My furnace didn't click, but seemed like it lit. release the button, seemed fine, turned to ON. no heat.


For Friday:

I refilled the tanks with fresh propane, the old tanks expired in 84, although I am sure it is not the issue, since they worked fine on the stove.

I packed a level. The camper isn't equiped with it's own, and all I did was eye ball it to start, then used a glass of water on the floor. Just before I left, I borrowed a level from a buddy and checked to see, and it is a couple degrees off to the stern. I'll level it properly this coming weekend.

I packed a butane torch, to try heating as suggested.
I packed a small nail file/emory board like chicks use to do their nails. It's going to be tough reaching in there with anything but that might be better for cleaning the contacts than an 8x11 sheet of 250 grit.
I packed some compressed air. a quick blast might dislodge a moth or something from in the chimney.
I packed a mirror, maybe a different angle of view might let me see in there a little bit better.
I packed my larger truck tool kit, which should have everything I may need, toolwise.

Is there some kind of thermostat for these things? How do you adjust the heat once it does work, or does it just keep pounding out the heat until you're cooked or you throw open a window?

Directly below the furnace, there is a cabinet door, which when the camper is loaded onto a truck would access the area in front of the wheel well, for a jack, or towstraps or whatever. The door doesn't close properly, so there is a 1/4" gap open to the outside. (probably how the moths got in). So if there was a propane leak, it is being readily vented.

I also hate the smell of raw propane, and can detect it rather well. Before lighting anything, I gave the whole camper a good sniff test, and didn't smell any leaks. And no... spraying water isn't feasible, especially since it doesn't heat up, and anything sprayed would just freeze.

Incidentally, I stayed in it every night anyways, even without the furnace. Most nights it was around -10C so rather comfortable in my sleeping bag. Two nights it dipped down to -23C, and it would have been nice to have.

[Possom]

I would throw a buddy heater and a couple small "camp stove" propane bottles in my rig just in case I couldn't get the furnace working. (Might calm some of the angry looks from a cold wife).

[Sniper-T]

this weekend is just another hunting trip for me (sans wife) and I'm not worried about me. lol

But I'm thinking I might like to take her in a month or so, where we'll do a 6-8 hour snowmobile ride out there, spend a day or two, and come back. She... SHE would not be a happy camper if it wasn't working!

[helomech]

momma aint happy aint no body happy

[Sniper-T]

happy wife = happy life!

[Daca102090]

On the older convection heaters there is usually a numbered knob that sticks out of the front of the protective grill. That is the temperature setting with 1 being lowest and 9 being highest. On mine (11 ft) I usually have it set between 3 and 4 and this is usually plenty warm. Without looking for myself I am just guessing now.


yep sorry I should have said that. it is a 3 position dial
OFF
Pilot (with a note) will not heat from this positon)
On

for the pilot, you have to depress and hold until it lights, and then I assumed it was like the old seville fridge we had at the cabin, continue to hold until it 'clicks' and lights.

My furnace didn't click, but seemed like it lit. release the button, seemed fine, turned to ON. no heat.


For Friday:

I refilled the tanks with fresh propane, the old tanks expired in 84, although I am sure it is not the issue, since they worked fine on the stove.

I packed a level. The camper isn't equiped with it's own, and all I did was eye ball it to start, then used a glass of water on the floor. Just before I left, I borrowed a level from a buddy and checked to see, and it is a couple degrees off to the stern. I'll level it properly this coming weekend.

I packed a butane torch, to try heating as suggested.
I packed a small nail file/emory board like chicks use to do their nails. It's going to be tough reaching in there with anything but that might be better for cleaning the contacts than an 8x11 sheet of 250 grit.
I packed some compressed air. a quick blast might dislodge a moth or something from in the chimney.
I packed a mirror, maybe a different angle of view might let me see in there a little bit better.
I packed my larger truck tool kit, which should have everything I may need, toolwise.

Is there some kind of thermostat for these things? How do you adjust the heat once it does work, or does it just keep pounding out the heat until you're cooked or you throw open a window?

Directly below the furnace, there is a cabinet door, which when the camper is loaded onto a truck would access the area in front of the wheel well, for a jack, or towstraps or whatever. The door doesn't close properly, so there is a 1/4" gap open to the outside. (probably how the moths got in). So if there was a propane leak, it is being readily vented.

I also hate the smell of raw propane, and can detect it rather well. Before lighting anything, I gave the whole camper a good sniff test, and didn't smell any leaks. And no... spraying water isn't feasible, especially since it doesn't heat up, and anything sprayed would just freeze.

Incidentally, I stayed in it every night anyways, even without the furnace. Most nights it was around -10C so rather comfortable in my sleeping bag. Two nights it dipped down to -23C, and it would have been nice to have.

[ElevenBravo]

Well, keep us posted on the progress.. Im intently interested in what the fix is going to be...

EB

[bacpacker]

Me too. The only dealings I've had was just cleaning out the mess the critters made. Otherwise they always worked.

[Sniper-T]

Update.

Another chilly weekend in the camper.

I blew everything out that could be blown out.
I sanded everything down that could be sanded.
I heated everything inside that could be heated.

No heat, luckily it was only -20C. and that thing is pretty much wind tight!

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt140/Sniper-T/1124131119a_zpsc8ce5c11.jpg (http://s605.photobucket.com/user/Sniper-T/media/1124131119a_zpsc8ce5c11.jpg.html)

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt140/Sniper-T/1124131119b_zpsf2c3737c.jpg (http://s605.photobucket.com/user/Sniper-T/media/1124131119b_zpsf2c3737c.jpg.html)

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt140/Sniper-T/1124131119c_zps63cdfe13.jpg (http://s605.photobucket.com/user/Sniper-T/media/1124131119c_zps63cdfe13.jpg.html)

http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt140/Sniper-T/1124131119d_zps964c73a2.jpg (http://s605.photobucket.com/user/Sniper-T/media/1124131119d_zps964c73a2.jpg.html)

[ElevenBravo]

7.62X54R should motivate the bugger!

[Possom]

I know this is an obviously dumb question for me to ask but are you sure your furnace is not a 110 electric fan to force the heat through the vent? The furnace might be lighting just no blower running to force the air out.

[Sniper-T]

No such thing as a dumb question in my world. An yeah, the thing stay's cool enough to keep my milk chilled. when they're working right, that whole camper would be shorts weather.

[TroubleShooter]

Ok, pilot stays lit...thermocoupler and supply should good.... Next up, blower comes on when you turn thermostat knob....if yes and no flame....this older unit should have a centrigful switch which tells gas valve to open....that would be my next check..

[TroubleShooter]

I don't see any wires in the pic...is there another electric valve after the pilot control ? These things are so simple , can't be much wrong...You have model # and brand?

[ElevenBravo]

Let me run down what Im thinking.... maybe something there will help...

1) Press LIGHT on gas controller, allows gas to flow to the pilot light but only as long as the button is pushed

2) Light pilot, keep button pressed long enough the thermocoupler gets hot, which keeps the gas flowing to the
pilot light (when something goes wrong, like low gas pressure or pilot gets blown out, the thermocoupler gets cold
and shuts off gas to the pilot light)

4) Thermostat: This controls when the furnace "comes on". If temp drops a few degrees below the set temp,
the furnace comes on and runs until its just a few degrees above the set temp... or right "at it".

The thermostat should do two thing:
1) Cut on blower fan to force hot air
2) Cut on main gas on the gas controller to get fire on the flame rails

Im thinking a few things may be wrong
* gas controller is bad
* bad wires
* bad thermostat
* no power to the thermostat (bad wire, blown fuse, tripped breaker, bad battery, low voltage, etc..)

Again, I wish I were closer so I could help...
EB

[Sniper-T]

couple things that are making me think there EB.

When the valve is in 'off' I cannot light the pilot
turn to pilot, and from cold, I have to push it in to light it, and it stays lit even after releasing. If I blow it out, I can just relight it without holding it in. The flame from the pilot is directed directly onto the thermocoupler, and really doesn't change button in or out... nor does it really change when I turn the unit to on.

...

back to reading.

I just googled the make/model.

Hydro Flame BCR-10

fingers crossed.

Oh, and EB... no electrical, no fan. known as an 'Early Catalytic'


reading here now...

http://www.fixya.com/support/t14598088-hydro_flame_brc_10_rv_furnace_pilot

[TroubleShooter]

The valve is no longer made.............. This unit is interesting, basically a radiant heater with no electric. I say the gas valve is clogged or no good. the thermostat knob just varying the amount of gas entering the burner. Just like a standard gas stove knob, low, med, high. Only this one uses thermocouple to maintain pilot light and internal valve open for gas flow thru knob.........Will require disassembly for repair or a backyard modify.....A shot in dark could be the regulator on your tanks is set to low, not enough pressure to activate gas valve but enough to light pilot....

[Socalman]

So what was the final outcome on the heater? Did you ever get it to work?

[Sniper-T]

Season ended, didn't get back out after last posts. Hopefully be out again in the next week or two.