CB radios / technology

[Fatty]

So my next step in preps after the holidays is going to be in the communication department. I plan on going for my HAM radio license later on but i want to get to know more about CBs. ive been watching craigslist and theres been quite a few walkie talkie models.


Is it better to have a walkie talkie style over a vehicle mounted version? ( for mobility)

Would i be better getting a newer model vs an older one?

What basic options should i be looking for?

[Stg1swret]

Depends on what you plan to use it for. I'd suggest new, single side band , and both a base/vehile mount and the walkie talkie versions. SSB( single side band) will give you plenty of channel capability.

[izzyscout21]

I have both vehicle and handheld CB's. I like having the ability to broadcast a little farther with the vehicle mounted one. You can also use this at home and set up a sort of base station. Baccpacker can speak more intelligently about the power than I can, but I do know that when I've had mine on driving on the interstate, a lot of truckers get some crazy range out of theirs by amping up the power.

I have the handhelds so that If I have to go on foot for any reason, I still have at least some communications capability with my family in the car or at the house or wherever I have the base unit set up. They won't broadcast as far, but at least it's something.

I want to get my HAM permit, but in the meantime, I think that CB gives you a good amount of commo capability for not a lot invested. There's 40 channels to choose from, so the chances of finding a clear channel are pretty good.
I have some Motorola radios that are being worked on right now as well as some of the smaller FRS family radios. The CB kinda sits in the middle of the pack and gives me another option.

[Fatty]

Ok so in a BO situation, it would be optimal to have 1 amped capable vehicle cb and 2 hand helds along with 1 optional base station if i plan on picking up a HAM Base unit?

[Stg1swret]

That would be the ideal setup. Gives you the best flexibilty for any situation that may arise.

[izzyscout21]

That's been my plan. Hoping that if one commo system fails or isn't working, I can switch to the CB or another system. Hoping Bacpacker can chime in here. He's got a lot more workign knowledge than I do.

[Fatty]

Can a HAM setup receive cb traffic? And if so can it send traffic as well?

[Stg1swret]

A HAM setup can transmit and receive in the same band as CB operates in. I believe it is the 3 meter band if memory serves me correctly.

[bacpacker]

First off I haven't done much with a CB in many years, back when it was only 23 channels. So I won't swear to any of this. But this should be in the ball park. And I will try and make mention of legal according to the FCC and what happens in some cases.

I think CB legally is around 4 watts. Handhelds have a much smaller antenna, where you will probably use a mag mount or fixed to a mirror or trunk lid which should have a much longer antenna. The antenna's are they key to broadcast distance. Antenna's to work the best need to be cut, in length, to match the frequency you want to operate. I'll find the formula for that, I just can't remember it right at the moment. Cb runs somewhere around 11 Meters or about 26Mhz. It's just below the 10 meter Ham band, which is in the 28Mhz range. Note the lower Meter vs frequency. They are inversely proportional.

IMO, a Cb set up would be a mobile radio/antenna in each vehicle you plan to use. Another mobile as a base at the house/BOL. This station would have a long wire antenna cut to length and hung from a tree or mast to gain as much height as possible. All this will give max range. There should also be a handheld for each person in the group. All that said there are many folks who buy or build amplifier's for their set up. I've heard of some running 1000 watts both mobile and at home and can probably talk across states. That said the FCC could come down on them. They also have to supply the power to allow an amp like that to operate.

There are differences between ham and CB. Ham has a lot more frequencies in multiple bands. There range from 160mhz up to 1.2ghz. The bands are useful for various ranges depending on frequency. Assuming your running lower legal power on each band most anything from 144mhz up thru 1.2 ghz are mostly for shorter range comms, say 50 miles or less. The 6 meter band (50-54mhz) works sometimes for local comms, sometimes long range. 160mhz thru 28mhz are mostly for long range. across state or around the world.

Legal power limits vary by band from 5 watts up to 2000 watts. Same station set up's apply for ham as CB.

Ham radio's can be set up to receive or transmit out of legal ham bands, but again the FCC has rules and they are more likely to monitor and come down on the ham bands. There are actually folks called official observers who are hams and monitor and report problems such as jamming, running illegal power, etc.

[Gunfixr]

Yup, legally, CB band is limited to 4 watts output power. However, many folks have discovered that they can get away with more. This depends on a lot of things.
A radio with SSB (Single Side Band) is better than one without. As it was explained to me, when a signal is sent on a CB, it goes out on 3 bands, regular AM, Upper Sideband, and Lower Sideband, 4 watts each. When the transmitter is set to either Upper Sideband or Lower Sideband, all of the signal is concentrated to that one band, giving 12 watts of power output on that one band. Sideband is actually a Mhz transmission in between the channels, just above and just below.
CB radios can transmit quite far, but a lot of it depends on atmospheric conditions. Mostly, great distance is achieved through "skip" wherein a signal goes up into the atmosphere and bounces, coming back down sometimes far away from where it originated. There isn't much control to "skipping", and mostly you get what you get. Generally, all other things being equal, you get about 1 mile per watt of direct transmission. Good conditions will increase this.

Sometimes, less distance is a good thing. Remember, whenever you are concerned about others listening in, the less distance you are transmitting, the less likely there is to be a "party line". After all, in order to listen in, the signal has to reach the antennae.

[bacpacker]

That is one thought that holds very true with hams. Use the least amount of power needed to make contact. That is a important. less likely to be over heard and less likely to cause undo interference with others.

[izzyscout21]

So what you're saying is that you're going to come over and adjust everything I have that emits a freq to transmit to antarctica??

[bacpacker]

Not sure your Cb will make it quite that far. Argentina maybe, Antartica, not so sure.
:)

Are you running a Cb at home? Is so, what type antenna are you using?

[Fatty]

Alrighty, picked up my technicians manual on friday, started paging through it and was wondering if the there is a way the fcc etc could ever shut the shortwave community down? This hobby is already looking like a bottomless pit for experimentation and tweaking. :)

[bacpacker]

Fatty I think the FCC could shut down the airwaves. Right now they can recind an individuals licence and do at different times for offences.

Another thing, is the frequencies can be jammed so there are really no comms that could always be considered totally reliable. You can also be tracked while transmitting pretty easily, something to consider while using any type radio. Another reason to use the least amount of power for your transmissions.

In the very early days of Ham radio all the new increases in abilities was all due to experimentation. Not so much today, but a lot of hams play around with a lot of different things and sometimes hit on some very good useable stuff.

[Fatty]

Yeah, i assumed they could jam frequences and what not. I was just curious if they had a for sure power button to it all:).

[bacpacker]

Hard to say for certain, but i wouldn't be surprised.

[mollypup]

I still have the tiny CB radio my dad gave me about 30 years ago. I bought a new antennae for it but need to go and sit in the car and see if it still works. It'll turn on and light up but won't get a signal inside the house even with the antennae connected.

[The Stig]

Actually, I have to replace the CB in my girl-truck. Turned in on the other day to find out it had died.

[bacpacker]

How is the CB powered Stig? Tied into your fuse block or hooked to the battery? If it's hooked to the fuse block, pull the fuse and check it out. Also check any in line fuses the CB power cable has.
Do you have a volt meter of some kind?

[Robert96]

No such thing as a magic power button to turn it all off, and amateur spectrum is broad enough to make jamming it all extremely problematic. What they CAN do, is issue a notice during a time of national emergency (this happened during WW2) that prohibits any amateur activity. RACES and MARS would typically be exempt.

[rentprop1]

Yeah, i assumed they could jam frequences and what not. I was just curious if they had a for sure power button to it all:).

no one would waste their time jamming CB or 11 meter frequencies when there are so many others that radio guys could use, what you would need to jam all the frequencies over such a spectrum would me more any anyone even the military would care to take on, and would serve no purpose .....and there is no possible way to jam something for close 1 mile comms everywhere at once

[FL-Jeeper]

No such thing as a magic power button to turn it all off, and amateur spectrum is broad enough to make jamming it all extremely problematic. What they CAN do, is issue a notice during a time of national emergency (this happened during WW2) that prohibits any amateur activity. RACES and MARS would typically be exempt.

True on not being able to jam all frequencies nationwide however over a localized area, it is possible to jam a broad spectrum.

http://www.sesp.com/radio-jammers.asp

The technology can render RF comms inop over a large area. Our Army reportedly has a new MOS that can deploy it, 29E.

http://usmilitary.about.com/od/enlistedjobs/a/29e.htm

[realist]

I have just started getting back into radios after many years. That said I still have an issued radio that I can use but as for civilian use I am looking for more for my family. I just got my HAM license so that will be for me and hopefully my son in the future. However I would like some redundancy and that has lead me to CBs. I agree with the SSB since it gives more options. Does anyone have any make and model suggestions? I am looking at three fixed bases, four mobile and at least six handheld units. Thanks ahead of time.

[bacpacker]

Realist, talk to BWRR. I'm pretty sure he has a Cb with sideband. Not sure what brand it is. He might have some good insight for you.

[FL-Jeeper]

The only radio I've ever owned: http://www.wearecb.com/store/rf-limited-mini-magnum-small-30-watt-10-meter-mobile-radio-p-1700.html

Mini Magnum Features:
PLL Controlled Transceiver
28.000 to 29.690 MHz Frequency Range
30 Watts PEP RF Output Power
AM Mode
10 kHz Steps

The handmike was junk so I replaced it with a nice Road King (RK56) & threw the original in the back as a spare. It is used 100% for CB comms & I've got it tuned up good on a 3 foot glass antenna & I can talk fo evah. :D